Dropouts on Audirvana Origin

@RunHomeSlow Also thank you for your interest and response.

Yes, without upsampling I have no troubles - except that in my setup the DSD256 upsampling sounds way better - more airy and effortless

:notes: :eye: :headphones: :eye: :notes:
How much RAM did you have in your Intel Mac? … I’ve seen a trend in users with M1 Macs with 8GB of system RAM, distributing audio over Ethernet networks, having loss of sync issues (drop-outs)… My feeling is that 8GB of system RAM is not enough to manage application and network management demands with multiple clients, even on a fast M1 platform, maybe the M1 demands more RAM in these playback scenarios… General macOS 12.x.x applications use about 4GB on the M1 platforms…

It really doesn’t make sense to me to remodulate PCMxxx to DSD256 in Audirvana and then remodulate again in the iFi DAC… I would just let the iFi DAC do the remodulation of PCMxxx to DSDxxxx or let Audirvana be the only remodulator to DSD256… My feeling about DSD512 and DSD1024, is that DSD512 best auditioned in it’s native recorded state (no such recordings of note done at 45.2MHz [DSD1024]).… multiple remodulation processes will add noise artifacts. Remodulation of native DSD64, 128, 256 to DSD512 or DSD1024 makes sense to me, but trying to squeeze more from PCMxxx by remodulation to DSD512 or 1024 doesn’t make sense to me.

I personally remodulate all PCMxxx to DSD128 using SoX in Audirvana Studio with no issues… however I have 11.4 GB of buffer and 11,710MB pre-load memory (16GB system RAM, 2016 MBP quad-core i7, macOS 12.4, running 112db’s Redline Monitor AU plugin)

I had 40GB in my Intel Mac. But all my music is stored on the built-in harddisc - so there is no ethernet or streaming involved only hardwired .wav-files.

My choices are not based on technical knowledge or ideology - I know nothing about what Audirvana or my DAC do. But I do know that my DAC upsamles everything to DSD1024 (therefore it makes some sense that it gets a DSD256 signal) AND most importantly that my preferred setup is what sounds best.

When I look at the RAM and CPU load none of them exceed 50% load even when I have drop-outs.

:notes: :eye: :headphones: :eye: :notes:
You could not have had 40GB of system RAM on your old Mac, you may have had a 40GB HDD attached…
It’s a big mistake to put your music files on the onboard macOS system solid-state drive… This will cause access interrupts when fetching the audio files, when using Audirvana or any given high-quality audio player application…

Try just letting the iFi DAC do all of the remodulation of your PCMxxx files to DSDxxxx… don’t do any up-conversion/remodulation in Audirvana… and move your music files to an external storage device.

Don’t get wrapped-up in trying to determine what is going-on by trying to interpret your problem from the system performance dashboard…

I’ll try that :+1:

Granted I don’t use upsampling. But on both my Macs (M1 MacBook Pro and a 2017 MacBook Air) I have my local collection stored on external storage. Never had issues here with Audirvana Studio.

I’d recommend you do the same. Saves wear and tear on the Mac’s system drive. And in case of having to reinstall your Mac your music files are safely stored elsewhere.

@sandsOfArrakis Thanks!

I didn’t have any problems with Audirvana 3.5.50 on my iMac with 40 GB RAM and 1TB SSD - therefore I transferred the same settings to my new Mac Mini and Audirvana Origins.

I’ll try these changes for sure - lowering the SoX maximum filter bandwidth (% of Nyquist) and connecting my library from an external storage. I just want my setup to sound as good as possible - without drop-outs.

But does my setup explain that my problems with drop-outs also occur when I scroll the music library on the Audirvana Remote App on my iPad while playing music?

:notes: :eye: :headphones: :eye: :notes:

The obvious difference is the amount of system RAM that you have on the M1 MacMini (8GB) compared to your iMac (40GB)… This speaks to my statements in my previous responses, regarding system RAM requirements.

Don’t do any up-conversion/remodulation to DSDxxx in Audirvana… Your iFi iDSD Pro DAC should be the only source of up-conversion/remodulation to DSDxxxx… Forget about using SoX or R8Brain… You have great facility in the iFi DAC to shape your sound…

Yes… In the context of high-performance, Hi-Res music playback, it’s never a good idea to store your music files on the same SSD as your macOS system resides. You may not have perceived anomalies in the iMac system, however they existed in that system scenario as well, due to having the music library on the macOS system SDD. The amount of system RAM (8GB) available you are using, is playing into your interrupts, especially in the realm of remodulation to DSD and playback of DSD256 via DoP1.1. You are creating huge files when remodulating to DSDxxx.

(Edit)–
Use a short USB 3.1 interconnect if you are using USB to transmit the signal to the iDSD Pro and make sure the MacMini and the iDSD Pro are connected to a common power source/ground/earth… hopefully no other non-audio playback system devices, lights, appliances on that power distribution.

I’m not an expert but I don’t think you need tons of RAM, especially if your os is optimized. I have a computer with Windows 10 with only 4 gb of ram. In the past I had another (old) computer with 10 gb ram. I have an USB dac and buffer in as is around 1 gb. Upsampling power of two r8brain, dop 1.0, ks, voxengo. Beautiful sound. Sometimes i have some glitches but from few months the things are stable. So the question is: why such powerful machines for AS? Imo it’s really not necesary. Of course I can’t use DSD upsampling or more resource eating vsts’s. But with my setup I’m satisfied (for the moment).

LE: Oh, just read carefully. Upsampling to DSD256. Than… maybe you are right? :blush:

Hi Antoine, I updated my OS to 12.4. And the saga continues. The good news is, it’s not just Audirvana, but also Roon, or anything - I tried all combinations possible. with or without EQ etc., it doesn’t matter. When the CPU/Ram throttles, there are dropouts for an instant. I think it’s about M1. Because I never had a problem with my other Macs (intel) so far… So if you can find a fix, please let me know. In the meantime, I’ll just use my old MacBook.

Thanks

I also have the same problem, dropouts here and there. I have a mac Monterey 12.4 and Audirvana Origin (I had the same problem with Audirvana 3.5).
I tried to delete the app and reinstall. I install a new copy of mac os. All without success.
Please help me to find a solution. Thanks.

Did you also try other music players on your Mac? If they have dropouts too than the solution has to be found outside Audirvana.

The playback is ok with other players.

:notes: :eye: :headphones: :eye: :notes:@Andrea82
How much system RAM do you have in your M1 Mac?
Are you storing your music files on the same drive (SDD) that the macOS is installed on?
Are you using Ethernet audio distribution to multiple clients on the network?

I have a late 2015 mac, with Intel processor.
I have 16GB RAM. Some files are in the same SSD where the OS is installed, others are in a different SSD, connected to the mainboard.
All the files are locals, offline.

:notes: :eye: :headphones: :eye: :notes:

When you say:

What does this mean? Do you have two SSD’s in the computer or are you using Thunderbolt 3/USB4 to connect an external drive?

Does this mean you do not distribute audio to other devices via Ethernet or AirPlay or Bluetooth?

Do these drop-outs occur when you are doing other operations on your computer while listening to music?

Yes, I have two ssd inside the computer.

The dropouts occur randomly, I usually surf the web when I’m listening music. The problems happened especially in the beginning of a listening session. They seem to diminish the longer I play.

:notes: :eye: :headphones: :eye: :notes:

At what level do you have System Optimizer operating?
What is your preload buffer allocation?
(I personally use 11,710MB pre-load memory in Audirvana, on my MacBook Pro (15-inch, 2016), 2.7 GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7, Memory: 16 GB 2133 MHz LPDDR3)

All of my audio files are on an external USB3.0 HDD drive… I never use Audirvana as a background player when surfing the internet… it’s like taking a Ferrari to the go to the grocery store…

Try increasing or decreasing your pre-load memory… And, It’s possible that your System Optimizer settings are not compatible with your internet surfing while playing music via Audirvana scenario…

Hmmm. Surfing the web, especially if you don’t have too many tabs opened should not be a problem, this activity don’t consume too much resources even with a slow computer. So i can’t agree with Ferrari comparison. Most of us have a single device for general use, not just music. And should work, like with other players, even with few gigs buffer, like many others, not just me, as you can see on this forum. I think it’s not necesary to have a super powerfull computer for Audirvana, especially if you don’t use DSD upsampling and/or powerfull VST’s, like iZotope for example. You are not using Photoshop or video editing, just viewing a website. I have Studio and Windows but I felt it’s good to write because I had the same problem until few months ago. Then they changed something and the app is more stable.

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:notes: :eye: :headphones: :eye: :notes:@DGrigorescu

My perspective comes from experience and understanding how Audirvana usurps the macOS audio architecture so to exploit and optimize the data flowing into and through the application, the audio system API’s and through the hardware architecture and I/O interfaces on the platform…

The browser is always trying to access the core Audio/Video system, this can cause interrupts in a highly tuned playback application… For instance, I would never surf the web while recording 96k or 192k audio in Logic Pro and expect my recording to be free of interrupts…