1) Options for Audirvana 3.5.users? 2) The subscription model

It looks like there are many Audirvana users here who are very dissatisfied with the new business model. It seems that Audirvana is risking a massive loss of trust from its regular customers. I am also very disappointed and would like to explain this here in more detail.

I chose Audirvana 7 years ago for the following reasons:

1.	Audirvana was one of the few applications that offered the quality features that critical and analytical listeners place special value on, and at a comparably low price.
2.	Audirvana was specifically geared towards the needs of this audiophile audience and not towards mass consumption and mainstream.
3.	Audirvana was and is not only an excellent software audio player for high-resolution audio files including multichannel and gapless support as well as loudness normalization, but also offers powerful management functions for your own music collection with support for complex metadata.
4.	The support of plug-ins, for example for stereo or surround to binaural converters, head trackers, correction filters, etc. was also an important reason for my decision. (In the meantime this also works with "SoundSource" under macOS)

All of this had strengthened my confidence in Audirvana. In my opinion, the peculiarities of audiophile listeners are an intimate relationship with predominantly acoustic music. Maximum musical enjoyment not only requires the highest technical quality, but is also a special challenge for musicians, producers and listeners:

1.	Musical excellence can be found less often in mainstream productions because they are oriented towards quick profit,
2.	Acoustically generated music is many times more complex than electronically generated music. This mainly results from the physical characteristics of the solid-state acoustics of acoustic instruments. Many properties and effects of solid-state acoustics, such as shear stresses, direction and frequency-dependent speed of sound, various types of vibration and waves, non-linear dynamics and other features offer far more degrees of freedom and dimensions of sound generation than one-dimensional electronic sound generation
3.	Therefore, making virtuoso music is more difficult and requires more mastery and practice on the part of the musicians than with purely electronic sound production or heavily post-processed music
4.	the acoustic generation of sound enables a greater and more nuanced variety, a stronger as well as more subtle expressiveness and a stronger conveyance of liveliness and emotionality
5.	However, in addition to holistic emotional listening, it also requires attentive, focused, i.e. analytical listening. This requires the best listening conditions and wants to be learned
6.	It is the direct acoustic interaction of the musicians with one another, with the audience, with the acoustics of the room, i.e. the live character, that makes music come alive, enables emotional resonance and creates authenticity.
7.	Finally, the interplay of listener expectation, subtle phrasing, accents and moments of tension, the situational context and background knowledge are also components and prerequisites for enjoying music.

All of this leads to a different way of hearing. It requires leisure and almost ritual attunement and an exclusive focus on the music. This works best if you are the only listener and at the main listening point (MLP / sweetspot), because all recordings are made for this point and only there is it possible to tap into the complexity of the content and the spatiotemporal resolution as purely as possible. This is something completely different from a more or less passive (externally determined) mass consumption. Audiophiles want maximum control over the “what and how”, “when and where”. You therefore often have your own larger collection of outstanding recordings including related information that can be enjoyed undisturbed at the right time in a suitable place. It often is uniquely successful events and recordings of lasting value. One can say that such musical treasures are part of a timeless cultural asset. They often offer a complexity and variety that can be rediscovered again and again and different.

Of course, audiophile listeners are not always in the mode of active, analytical listening, because every ability to concentrate has its limits. You also hear emotionally holistically and perhaps also predominantly. What I want to say here is that different types of listening can be mutually exclusive and also have opposing requirements that are not always compatible with one another. Such an essential contrast is, for example, that audiophile listeners want exclusive availability of media and transmission channels, including software usage rights, and the mainstream also accepts shared media technologies and subscription models. The latter have a fundamental bandwidth problem:

1.	the shared media, which requires the individual user lossy encoding and
2.	that of the limited total capacity with an increasing number of users

My fear is that Audirvana Studio will be puffed up into an egg-laying woolly milk sow if it goes mainstream. This is also at the expense of simple, intuitive and consistent usability. For me, streaming is superfluous and combining a large number of my own HighResAudio files with streaming offers is an annoying ballast. I use these extensions do not want and do not want the additional costs and reject a subscription model from!

For me lossy audio content (incl. MQA), streaming and Internet radio are more suited for single, casual use. The interface to HighResAudio download services can, however, be a useful facility, either as access to your own downloads or to discover new things.

I fear that the now chosen path of Audirvana

1.	the turn to the mainstream follows a profit logic that sets in motion a momentum of its own that erodes the original ambitions and the demands of the audiophile listener lose importance
2.	the subscription model requires a leap of faith in future services with possibly useless features that I do not want to finance

In any case, the subscription model is not a trust-building measure, but the opposite.
If Audirvana has no other option for economic reasons, I suggest reconsidering the strategic decisions and better pursuing a modular approach, e.g. using a modular software architecture with

•	High-end audio player including remote apps (iOS, Android, macOS and Win server client) with an exclusive software license.
•	Content manager with exclusive software license.
•	Add-on for your own streaming server with LAN, WLAN, USB, HDMI, DLNA and HighResAudio as well as multichannel support (optional upgrade license to macOS, Windows, Linux, NAS) with exclusive software license and Remote app as a user interface.
•	Streaming add-on (upgrade license, optionally with an exclusive SW license or subscription license for everything).

That would be acceptable to me.

I hope you can agree with me and Audirvana hears the voices.

Hello,
Are there any concrete plans for how Audirvana 3.5 will develop in the near future or will the focus remain on the Studio version?

Most likely 3.5 won’t be developed anymore. Since you can’t buy a license for it any longer. And the Studio version is now the new jewel in the crown.

1 Like

Audirvana 3.5 is DEAD; no further feature developments will happen to it - it is not even open for sale anymore. Damien has chosen to put all his eggs in AS basket - whether he will succeed on the basis of the currently announced subscription model, nobody knows.

2 Likes

A PROPOSAL FOR A NEW COMMERCIAL STRATEGY FOR AUDIRVANA

It is clear at the present that the idea to subscribe to a player did not rise much enthusiasm among the users.
The reactions were already negatives at the moment of the presentation of Audirvana Studio on Facebook. Judging on the posts on this forum, it seems clear the trial of the player did convince of the users to adopt subscription.

For these reasons, I believe that Audirvana should rethink its commercial strategy and choose new ways to make business.

Damien should first fix the bugs and improve the player to make it a solid and an attractive product.
To his partner who seems to be in charge of commercial strategy, I would suggest studying the following advise.

1. BUNDLE AUDIRVANA STUDIO WITH QOBUZ AND/OR TIDAL SUBSCRIPTION

Audirvana should propose to Qobuz and Tidal to bundle Audirvana Studio with their subscription offer. This will be a win-win for everybody.

• It will help Qobuz and Tidal to improve the sound quality of the service that they offer. They will need it badly in order to differentiate their offer from the cheap competition coming from Apple Music and Amazon.

• Qobuz and Tidal could offer the player for free to their subscribed users or charge for it a symbolic fee of 1€ a month to those who choose to have it.
This will benefit of course the users who will not have to pay a double subscription in order to listen to a streaming service. The idea they might do it was an absurdity.

• It will help Audirvana to reach a very large number of users and make money from its player by the payment it would receive from Qobuz and Tidal.

2. SELL LICENSE OF AUDIRVANA STUDIO TO NON-STREAMING USERS

For users who do not stream, Audirvana should sell a license of the player as it always did. A good sounding player will always find buyers, even if the license is sold at a higher price than the license of the defunct A 3.5.
Just offer us a good player, and we will pay for it.

12 Likes

I couldn’t agree with you more !

Trés bien vu.
@Antoine est ce que Microsoft vous fait payer un abonnement pour intégrer votre source de profit dans son OS ?

I’m another customer who paid for software on the understanding that it would be supported and updated. I now find that even my customer account with Audirvana has been deleted, a terrible example of how not to conduct good customer relations!
I have tried out Audirvana Studio, which has a number of aspects that are actually worse than 3.5 and gives a poorer user experience.
Like other software that I own, I would have been prepared to pay a small amount for major updates, but not for migrating to a worse experience and having to pay for ever for it! I migrated to Audirvana from Roon for this very reason.
I will not be subscribing and will happily use 3,5 until I find another committed, customer focussed developer who makes good audio software. If there aren’t any around yet, this move by Audirvana will open up an opportunity…

1 Like

J’ai pris le temps de faire mise à jour d’AS V1.3, alors je poste maintenant le texte français de mon message.

UNE PROPOSITION À AUDIRVANA D’UNE NOUVELLE STRATÉGIE COMMERCIALE

Il est clair à l’heure actuelle que l’idée de s’abonner à un lecteur de musique n’a pas suscité beaucoup d’enthousiasme parmi les utilisateurs.
Les réactions étaient déjà négatives au moment de la présentation d’Audirvana Studio sur Facebook. À en juger par les messages sur ce forum, il semble clair que l’essai d’Audirvana Studio n’a pas convaincu la plupart des utilisateurs d’adhérer à l’offre d’abonnement.

Pour ces raisons, je pense qu’Audirvana devrait repenser sa stratégie commerciale et choisir des nouvelles voies.

Damien devrait d’abord corriger les bugs et améliorer le lecteur pour en faire un produit solide et attrayant.
Quant à son associé, qui semble être chargé de la stratégie commerciale, je suggérerais, en toute humilité, de considérer les conseils suivants.

1. FAITES UNE OFFRE GROUPÉE D’AUDIRVANA STUDIO AVEC L’ABONNEMENT À QOBUZ ET/OU À TIDAL

Audirvana devrait proposer à Qobuz et à Tidal d’offrir Audirvana Studio aux abonnés de leur service. Ce sera un gagnant-gagnant pour tout le monde.

• Cela permettra à Qobuz et à Tidal d’améliorer la qualité sonore du service qu’ils proposent et d’ajouter des fonctionnalités qui lui manquent. Ils en auront grandement besoin pour différencier leur offre de la concurrence bon marché d’Apple Music et d’Amazon.

• Qobuz et Tidal pourraient offrir le lecteur gratuitement à leurs abonnés ou de le l’offrir comme une option payante à un prix symbolique de 1 € par mois aux abonnés qui choisiraient de l’avoir.
Cela profitera bien entendu aux utilisateurs qui n’auront pas à payer un double abonnement pour écouter un service de streaming. L’idée qu’ils le ferraient était une aberration dès le départ.

• Cela permettra à Audirvana d’atteindre un grand marché de très nombreux d’utilisateurs et de gagner de l’argent avec les paiements qu’elle recevra de Qobuz et de Tidal.

2. VENDRE LA LICENCE D’AUDIRVANA STUDIO AUX UTILISATEURS NON ABONNÉS AUX SERVICES DE STREAMING

Pour les utilisateurs qui n’utilisent pas les services de streaming, Audirvana devrait vendre une licence du lecteur comme elle l’a toujours fait. Un bon lecteur trouvera toujours preneur, même si la licence serait vendue à un prix plus élevé que la licence du défunt A 3.5.
Offrez-nous un bon lecteur de musique et nous paierons pour ça.

1 Like

Very much not a dead parrot in my cage. Works exactly as it did the day it was purchased.

I think it’s best not to say things that are not true. An opinion is one thing. A truth, another.

4 Likes

It’s amazing how certain people are intellectually unable or unwilling to understand basic language points just for the sake of winning a pissing contest around here.

When I say “dead”, it’s OBVIOUS that I am talking about 3.5 no longer being actively supported/receiving new features, as it is not even available for purchase anymore. THAT was the crux of the question posed above. It does NOT mean it stopped working when AS was launched.

Clear now or do you still want to have the last word just for the sake of it?

7 Likes

I bought 3.5 in March for 97€, two months later no update was issued by the developer. As a new user I’m so disappointed of this practice. Now my ‘‘old’’ version is functional, but you may call it ‘‘dead in the water’’ since the developer won’t waste any more time improving it for the years to come.

Even if I do like the AS, I won’t subscribe for it. In fact, I’ve just deleted it from my mac computer. It has nothing to do with being able or not to understand the commercial strategy of the developer, but it has 100% to do with the disappointment as a new user: getting a ‘‘dead software’’ not for cheap, and the only ‘‘upgrade’’ option is the lousy 20€ discount.

I’ll continue to use the 3.5 as long as it will be possible, but this stunt with the subscription-based license was enough for me to refrain of buying any other Audirvana product in the foreseeable future. People doing such things are not worth of supporting.

2 Likes

Last update 8 days ago. Just sayin’.

1 Like

How about yesterday!

Sorry just read the title, please ignore.

And what is the company’s stated support for the product going forward?

Apologies in case I sounded a bit too harsh in the reply above; my point was simply to emphasize that, other than minor bug/security fixes, nothing else will be done for 3.5. And this is what irritates some around here, particularly when there is no more “permanent” licensing option under AS, and 3.5 was still being sold a few weeks ago as a lifetime flagship product.

4 Likes

I completely get that. But the new AUDIRVĀNA STUDIO will surely, hopefully, give us a greater player. AS is meant to surpass the 3.5 engine. A complete rewrite I believe.

Those who purchased Audirvana for previous year should maybe get some kind of deal that gives them a lifetime discou t on subscription for five years.

For me, I’ll subscribe and ride this baby until it’s perfect.

[I’m not only for having the last word. I do like the debate.]

2 Likes

Has anyone compared subscription Audirvana Studio SQ with free Hysolid? I did with 3.5 and Hysolid (despite its bugginess) won hands down IMO…

The problem I have with Hysolid is that the app to control it does not work on Android anymore, so it is unusable for me. Also if you look on the developers site the last update is from years ago. It does not seem that it is still in active development.

I jumped in and bought 3.5 less than a year ago and have to say I’m disappointed with the shift to a subscription model. In the fullness of time Studio may be an excellent piece of software, at the moment though it’s still marred by bugs and issues which precludes me from even considering it at the moment

Damien and the team should have looked at bringing existing customers in from the outset. They could have easily have asked for volunteers to run the Beta tests, (who in turn would have leaked out the improvements over the old system), test out the reactions to various cost/subscription models and more importantly tried to get the community on board by detailing what the long term plans for Audirvana were, as well as the improvements and advantages of the new system in terms of audio quality and customer user interface would entail. Also, there could have been a more generous inducement for existing customers who have 3.5 or similar, perhaps 6 months free or a decent monthly discount for a year?

What doesn’t sit right is that Studio has been foisted upon us as a ‘fait acompli’ and existing customers are being asked to pay full rates from the getgo for a substandard product. I fear Audirvana may lose a large part of its core following as a result. It’s obvious Audirvana is trying to emulate Roon, however, at this moment, it’s in no way comparable in terms of the user interface. If 3.5 stops working for me, then unfortunately due to the reasons outlined above, I’ll be jumping to Roon,

4 Likes